PC won't connect to Inet at different location

[bill a]

I had an old desktop pc with Win2000Pro connected on my DSL router and fully

updated Windows, etc and the internet connection worked fine.

I gave the box to a friend who uses a cable modem, and the box will not

connect to the internet there (no router).

The desktop settings have been the vanilla settings: obtain IP and DNS

addresses automatically, DHCP enabled, etc. The tray icon shows when the

cable is plugged in. The same modem and cable work fine when a laptop is

connected to it.

I had the guy put the laptop back on and run ipconfig so I could get the

gateway IP.

With the desktop, I could not ping the IP for the gateway address that

showed in the laptop's ipconfig.

Is there a procedure I should run to reset something after moving from a LAN

with a router to a direct connection to a cable modem?

 

[Greg Russell]

In news:OQzndUArKHA.5036@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl,

bill a typed:



> I had the guy put the laptop back on and run ipconfig so I could get

> the gateway IP.

> With the desktop, I could not ping the IP for the gateway address

> that showed in the laptop's ipconfig.



But did the ipconfig on the desktop show that was was configured properly,

with an IP address, netmask, DNS servers and gateway to match that of the

laptop? (different IP address though).



> Is there a procedure I should run to reset something after moving

> from a LAN with a router to a direct connection to a cable modem?



Two things:



1) Are you using a crossover cable for the direct connection to the modem?

Some ethernet interfaces will automatically deal with either a crossover or

patch cable, but others are insistent on a crossover cable for such a direct

connection. It may be that the two machines' interfaces differ in their

capacity for such a cable as you're using.



2) Assuming out-of-hand that the "ipconfig /all" settings are identical for

both the desktop and the laptop, and that only one of them is "directly"

connected at any given time, it sounds as if the cable modem is expecting

the direct conecction to the MAC address of the laptop which differs from

the MAC address of the desktop ... this is called the "Physical Address" in

your ipconfig output and it consists of 6 hexadecimal numbers such as:



Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-20-18-C0-BB-84



The same problem happens when a simple "switch" is used to allow both of

your computers to be connected. The switch knows which MAC is connected to

each port on the switch, and swapping those connections will cause both to

fail until one power-cycles the switch and it re-learns the correct MAC

association with each port.



The problem doesn't occur with a hub, as a simple hub sends the same packets

to every port on it.



By way of testing, I'll suggest that you connect the desktop and then

power-cycle the modem, then on the desktop do an "ipconfig /renew" and see

if that fixes things.



*Always* check the "ipconfig /all" and "route print" settings before drawing

any conclusions about anything.

 

[bill a]

The patch cable I sent along with the desktop was a straight thru cable, and

we also tried the cable he had been using with the laptop, which I haven't

had a chance to look at, but I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have had a xover..

The laptop is WinXP, but I don't know where it is on SP's.

The power cycling idea sounds promising. I take it that a modem records the

MAC from whatever computer is first hooked up, and then expects that no

other MAC will be connected while the modem is powered up? I suppose in

normal usage, that wouldn't be problem.

I hope to get over to the guy's house in the next couple days. I already

told him to try the power cycling, which he may get to tomorrow.



Thanks Greg



Bill





"Greg Russell" wrote in message

news:7tlp84Fg0lU1@mid.individual.net...

> In news:OQzndUArKHA.5036@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl,

> bill a typed:

>

>> I had the guy put the laptop back on and run ipconfig so I could get

>> the gateway IP.

>> With the desktop, I could not ping the IP for the gateway address

>> that showed in the laptop's ipconfig.

>

> But did the ipconfig on the desktop show that was was configured properly,

> with an IP address, netmask, DNS servers and gateway to match that of the

> laptop? (different IP address though).

>

>> Is there a procedure I should run to reset something after moving

>> from a LAN with a router to a direct connection to a cable modem?

>

> Two things:

>

> 1) Are you using a crossover cable for the direct connection to the modem?

> Some ethernet interfaces will automatically deal with either a crossover

> or

> patch cable, but others are insistent on a crossover cable for such a

> direct

> connection. It may be that the two machines' interfaces differ in their

> capacity for such a cable as you're using.

>

> 2) Assuming out-of-hand that the "ipconfig /all" settings are identical

> for

> both the desktop and the laptop, and that only one of them is "directly"

> connected at any given time, it sounds as if the cable modem is expecting

> the direct conecction to the MAC address of the laptop which differs from

> the MAC address of the desktop ... this is called the "Physical Address"

> in

> your ipconfig output and it consists of 6 hexadecimal numbers such as:

>

> Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-20-18-C0-BB-84

>

> The same problem happens when a simple "switch" is used to allow both of

> your computers to be connected. The switch knows which MAC is connected to

> each port on the switch, and swapping those connections will cause both to

> fail until one power-cycles the switch and it re-learns the correct MAC

> association with each port.

>

> The problem doesn't occur with a hub, as a simple hub sends the same

> packets

> to every port on it.

>

> By way of testing, I'll suggest that you connect the desktop and then

> power-cycle the modem, then on the desktop do an "ipconfig /renew" and see

> if that fixes things.

>

> *Always* check the "ipconfig /all" and "route print" settings before

> drawing

> any conclusions about anything.

>

>

>

>

 

[Robbie Hatley]

"bill a" wrote:



> I had an old desktop pc with Win2000Pro connected on my DSL

> router and fully updated Windows, etc and the internet

> connection worked fine. I gave the box to a friend who uses

> a cable modem, and the box will not connect to the internet

> there.



I had exactly the same problem. The cause is far more simple

than you imagine: Cable services do not support Windows 2000.

It's an ISP issue, not a hardware or software issue. But

don't despair, there's a workaround. Keep reading.



> (no router).



That's why. Buy a router (Cisco or Belkin are good). Just hook

the cables up, putting the router between the Cable Modem and the

computer. Usually no need to adjust it in any way.

Your problem will go away, instantly and like magic.

Yes, it really is as simple as that.



The reason? Cable ISPs query the computer they see,

and if they see "Windows 2000" as operating system, they balk.

But if they see "Cisco router firmware" as Operating System,

the connection works.



> ... desktop settings ...



Barking up wrong tree.



> ... DHCP enabled ...



I don't use DHCP myself (I manually set the IPs),

but it does make life easier for most users.



> The same modem and cable work fine when a laptop is

> connected to it.



The Laptop is XP, and the Desktop is 2K, right?

That's why.



> I had the guy put the laptop back on and run ipconfig so I

> could get the gateway IP.



I had my cable guy do the same. He wasn't able to get it

to work. But when I put a router in there, the problem

went away.



I had same trouble at my mother's house: different computer,

different Cable ISP, same OS (Windows 2000), same problem

(no internet), same solution (install a router).



Don't worry about ISP gateway. Leave the router's

settings at default (DHCP server should be enabled).

Your router will likely have default gateway 192.168.0.1,

and its DHCP server will likely assign IP 192.168.0.2

to your desktop.



As for what your ISP's gateway is, that becomes a don't-care.

You can query your router, usually at http://192.168.0.1/ using

any web brower, if you really want to know. It will give you

your IP as the outside world sees it, along with ISP gateway,

something like this:



Gateway: 79.129.0.1 (depends on your ISP)

IP: 79.129.37.82 (assigned by your ISP)



(Which is completely boring and totally useless information,

unless you're running an Internet server on dyndns or something.)



> With the desktop, I could not ping the IP for the gateway

> address that showed in the laptop's ipconfig.



That's because your ISP supports WinXP but not Win2K.

So use a router. Your operating system (as your ISP sees it)

will then be "Cisco Router Firmware".



> Is there a procedure I should run to reset something after

> moving from a LAN with a router to a direct connection to

> a cable modem?



Yes. You need a router. (See above.)



You can get a good wired Cisco router for about $50,

or wireless for about $75. Shop around.



OR, you can find an XP install CD, and upgrade....

but the router is the faster and easier way.



--

Cheers,

Robbie Hatley

lonewolf at well dot com

www dot well dot com slant tilde lonewolf slant

 

[bill a]

adding a router did the trick.



thanks robbie



bill



"Robbie Hatley" wrote in message

news:NMadnRzUP_Etu-rWnZ2dnUVZ_qGdnZ2d@giganews.com...

>

> "bill a" wrote:

>

>> I had an old desktop pc with Win2000Pro connected on my DSL

>> router and fully updated Windows, etc and the internet

>> connection worked fine. I gave the box to a friend who uses

>> a cable modem, and the box will not connect to the internet

>> there.

>

> I had exactly the same problem. The cause is far more simple

> than you imagine: Cable services do not support Windows 2000.

> It's an ISP issue, not a hardware or software issue. But

> don't despair, there's a workaround. Keep reading.

>

>> (no router).

>

> That's why. Buy a router (Cisco or Belkin are good). Just hook

> the cables up, putting the router between the Cable Modem and the

> computer. Usually no need to adjust it in any way.

> Your problem will go away, instantly and like magic.

> Yes, it really is as simple as that.

>

> The reason? Cable ISPs query the computer they see,

> and if they see "Windows 2000" as operating system, they balk.

> But if they see "Cisco router firmware" as Operating System,

> the connection works.

>

>> ... desktop settings ...

>

> Barking up wrong tree.

>

>> ... DHCP enabled ...

>

> I don't use DHCP myself (I manually set the IPs),

> but it does make life easier for most users.

>

>> The same modem and cable work fine when a laptop is

>> connected to it.

>

> The Laptop is XP, and the Desktop is 2K, right?

> That's why.

>

>> I had the guy put the laptop back on and run ipconfig so I

>> could get the gateway IP.

>

> I had my cable guy do the same. He wasn't able to get it

> to work. But when I put a router in there, the problem

> went away.

>

> I had same trouble at my mother's house: different computer,

> different Cable ISP, same OS (Windows 2000), same problem

> (no internet), same solution (install a router).

>

> Don't worry about ISP gateway. Leave the router's

> settings at default (DHCP server should be enabled).

> Your router will likely have default gateway 192.168.0.1,

> and its DHCP server will likely assign IP 192.168.0.2

> to your desktop.

>

> As for what your ISP's gateway is, that becomes a don't-care.

> You can query your router, usually at http://192.168.0.1/ using

> any web brower, if you really want to know. It will give you

> your IP as the outside world sees it, along with ISP gateway,

> something like this:

>

> Gateway: 79.129.0.1 (depends on your ISP)

> IP: 79.129.37.82 (assigned by your ISP)

>

> (Which is completely boring and totally useless information,

> unless you're running an Internet server on dyndns or something.)

>

>> With the desktop, I could not ping the IP for the gateway

>> address that showed in the laptop's ipconfig.

>

> That's because your ISP supports WinXP but not Win2K.

> So use a router. Your operating system (as your ISP sees it)

> will then be "Cisco Router Firmware".

>

>> Is there a procedure I should run to reset something after

>> moving from a LAN with a router to a direct connection to

>> a cable modem?

>

> Yes. You need a router. (See above.)

>

> You can get a good wired Cisco router for about $50,

> or wireless for about $75. Shop around.

>

> OR, you can find an XP install CD, and upgrade....

> but the router is the faster and easier way.

>

> --

> Cheers,

> Robbie Hatley

> lonewolf at well dot com

> www dot well dot com slant tilde lonewolf slant

>

>

 

[Robbie Hatley]

"bill a" wrote (regarding Win2K computer that wouldn't

connect to cable ISP):



> adding a router did the trick.

>

> thanks robbie

>

> bill



Toontastic! Glad you're up and running, and thanks for the

feedback! I was about 99% sure that I had a handle on the

cause & cure, but it's good to get confirmation.



--

Cheers,

Robbie Hatley

lonewolf at well dot com

www dot well dot com slant tilde lonewolf slant