Dead machine, loose connection?

[ms]

History on this generic P550 machine:

Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine. Used it
occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few times to get it
going. Shut down normally the last time.

A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.

Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection, everything looks
tight.

The only symptom, when AC applied, the 3 lights (power, hard drive, ??)
flash, then off.

What does the symptom indicate, and to proceed from here?

ms

 

[kim]

sounds like the power supply unit has gone.

"ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:5ma8p0Fch2t3U1@mid.individual.net...
> History on this generic P550 machine:
>
> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine. Used it
> occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few times to get it
> going. Shut down normally the last time.
>
> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>
> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection, everything
> looks
> tight.
>
> The only symptom, when AC applied, the 3 lights (power, hard drive, ??)
> flash, then off.
>
> What does the symptom indicate, and to proceed from here?
>
> ms

 

[ms]

"kim" <faked@ntlhell.com> wrote in
news:#Ymt7T5AIHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl:

> sounds like the power supply unit has gone.
>

The recent history showed it was still good. Even if it finally died, the
front panel lights would not flash when power is applied, IMO

ms

> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
> news:5ma8p0Fch2t3U1@mid.individual.net...
>> History on this generic P550 machine:
>>
>> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine.
>> Used it occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few
>> times to get it going. Shut down normally the last time.
>>
>> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>>
>> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection, everything
>> looks
>> tight.
>>
>> The only symptom, when AC applied, the 3 lights (power, hard drive,
>> ??) flash, then off.
>>
>> What does the symptom indicate, and to proceed from here?
>>
>> ms
>
>

 

[dadiOH]

ms wrote:
> History on this generic P550 machine:
>
> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine.
> Used it occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few
> times to get it going. Shut down normally the last time.
>
> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>
> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection,
> everything looks tight.

Just because it looks that way doesn't mean it is. Wires break
invisibly within the insulation...wires come loose from the PS
terminals. Ditto with IDE cables.

Having to bump indicates *something* loose. Of course, all that
bumping may have tilted it to death


--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

 

[Brian A.]

"dadiOH" <dadiOH@guesswhere.com> wrote in message
news:O9z8ZO6AIHA.2268@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> ms wrote:
>> History on this generic P550 machine:
>>
>> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine.
>> Used it occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few
>> times to get it going. Shut down normally the last time.
>>
>> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>>
>> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection,
>> everything looks tight.
>
> Just because it looks that way doesn't mean it is. Wires break
> invisibly within the insulation...wires come loose from the PS
> terminals. Ditto with IDE cables.
>
> Having to bump indicates *something* loose. Of course, all that
> bumping may have tilted it to death

Just like the good ol' thump upside a tv to get the picture back.


--

Brian A. Sesko { MS MVP_Shell/User }
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

 

[ms]

"dadiOH" <dadiOH@guesswhere.com> wrote in news:O9z8ZO6AIHA.2268
@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:

> ms wrote:
>> History on this generic P550 machine:
>>
>> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine.
>> Used it occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few
>> times to get it going. Shut down normally the last time.
>>
>> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>>
>> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection,
>> everything looks tight.
>
> Just because it looks that way doesn't mean it is. Wires break
> invisibly within the insulation...wires come loose from the PS
> terminals. Ditto with IDE cables.
>
> Having to bump indicates *something* loose. Of course, all that
> bumping may have tilted it to death
>
>

Suggesting disconnect a connector, check wires, reconnect, starting with
power supply output. Then check MB connections, then go to other
connectors?

Comment?

ms

 

[Brian A.]

"ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message news:5mali7FcfmvfU1@mid.individual.net...
> "dadiOH" <dadiOH@guesswhere.com> wrote in news:O9z8ZO6AIHA.2268
> @TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:
>
>> ms wrote:
>>> History on this generic P550 machine:
>>>
>>> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine.
>>> Used it occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few
>>> times to get it going. Shut down normally the last time.
>>>
>>> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>>>
>>> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection,
>>> everything looks tight.
>>
>> Just because it looks that way doesn't mean it is. Wires break
>> invisibly within the insulation...wires come loose from the PS
>> terminals. Ditto with IDE cables.
>>
>> Having to bump indicates *something* loose. Of course, all that
>> bumping may have tilted it to death
>>
>>
>
> Suggesting disconnect a connector, check wires, reconnect, starting with
> power supply output. Then check MB connections, then go to other
> connectors?
>
> Comment?

Yes, check them all to make sure they are properly and securely seated/connected.


--

Brian A. Sesko { MS MVP_Shell/User }
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

 

[ms]

"Brian A." <gonefish'n@afarawaylake> wrote in
news:uDGN687AIHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl:

> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
> news:5mali7FcfmvfU1@mid.individual.net...
>> "dadiOH" <dadiOH@guesswhere.com> wrote in news:O9z8ZO6AIHA.2268
>> @TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:
>>
>>> ms wrote:
>>>> History on this generic P550 machine:
>>>>
>>>> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine.
>>>> Used it occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few
>>>> times to get it going. Shut down normally the last time.
>>>>
>>>> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>>>>
>>>> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection,
>>>> everything looks tight.
>>>
>>> Just because it looks that way doesn't mean it is. Wires break
>>> invisibly within the insulation...wires come loose from the PS
>>> terminals. Ditto with IDE cables.
>>>
>>> Having to bump indicates *something* loose. Of course, all that
>>> bumping may have tilted it to death
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Suggesting disconnect a connector, check wires, reconnect, starting
>> with power supply output. Then check MB connections, then go to other
>> connectors?
>>
>> Comment?
>
> Yes, check them all to make sure they are properly and securely
> seated/connected.
>
>

Brian

I just searched/saved a bunch of data on troubleshooting, even on
troubleshooting power supplies.

This desktop is basic inside, no extras. Each connector is very firmly in
place. There seems to be no loose wires, nothing loose in the case.

I know it can be risky to arbitrarily disconnect a good connection and
reconnect, haven't done a lot of that, and it can happen that the
connector/board is ruined.

Before I spend a few days to digest all that data, or dig into the
cables, there is one question that was not answered.

When I apply power, the 3 case lights flash. If the supply is dead, no
output, so the hard drive light would not light? The 3rd light (?) is
surely an output light and it would not light? Even the power light is
probably on the PS output, not across the power switch, so it would not
light if the PS was dead?

I would appreciate an answer to the above before I get into real
troubleshooting? If the supply is still good, that simplifies the
procedure.

Thanks

ms

 

[ms]

ms <ms@invalid.com> wrote in news:5mco8sFcqde2U1@mid.individual.net:

> "Brian A." <gonefish'n@afarawaylake> wrote in
> news:uDGN687AIHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl:
>
>> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
>> news:5mali7FcfmvfU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> "dadiOH" <dadiOH@guesswhere.com> wrote in news:O9z8ZO6AIHA.2268
>>> @TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:
>>>
>>>> ms wrote:
>>>>> History on this generic P550 machine:
>>>>>
>>>>> Appeared dead. A month later, setting it on a bench, it ran fine.
>>>>> Used it occasionally for 6 months, did have to bump the case a few
>>>>> times to get it going. Shut down normally the last time.
>>>>>
>>>>> A week later, dead. I bumped it again, nothing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Opened it up expecting to see an obvious loose connection,
>>>>> everything looks tight.
>>>>
>>>> Just because it looks that way doesn't mean it is. Wires break
>>>> invisibly within the insulation...wires come loose from the PS
>>>> terminals. Ditto with IDE cables.
>>>>
>>>> Having to bump indicates *something* loose. Of course, all that
>>>> bumping may have tilted it to death
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Suggesting disconnect a connector, check wires, reconnect, starting
>>> with power supply output. Then check MB connections, then go to
>>> other connectors?
>>>
>>> Comment?
>>
>> Yes, check them all to make sure they are properly and securely
>> seated/connected.
>>
>>
>
> Brian
>
> I just searched/saved a bunch of data on troubleshooting, even on
> troubleshooting power supplies.
>
> This desktop is basic inside, no extras. Each connector is very firmly
> in place. There seems to be no loose wires, nothing loose in the case.
>
> I know it can be risky to arbitrarily disconnect a good connection and
> reconnect, haven't done a lot of that, and it can happen that the
> connector/board is ruined.
>
> Before I spend a few days to digest all that data, or dig into the
> cables, there is one question that was not answered.
>
> When I apply power, the 3 case lights flash. If the supply is dead, no
> output, so the hard drive light would not light? The 3rd light (?) is
> surely an output light and it would not light? Even the power light is
> probably on the PS output, not across the power switch, so it would
> not light if the PS was dead?
>
> I would appreciate an answer to the above before I get into real
> troubleshooting? If the supply is still good, that simplifies the
> procedure.
>
> Thanks
>
> ms
>
The machine may have answered the question.

I applied power again, also the floppy drive light came on, believe this
is saying the floppy drive is getting power from the PS. Turned off AC,
turned it on again seconds later, now no lights show. Repeated test, no
lights.

Indicates a dead PS?

ms

 

[dadiOH]

ms wrote:

> The machine may have answered the question.
>
> I applied power again, also the floppy drive light came on, believe
> this is saying the floppy drive is getting power from the PS.
> Turned off AC, turned it on again seconds later, now no lights
> show. Repeated test, no lights.
>
> Indicates a dead PS?

No, it indicates a loose connection somewhere

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

 

[dadiOH]

ms wrote:

> This desktop is basic inside, no extras. Each connector is very
> firmly in place.

Just because it is firmly in place doesn't mean there is a good
connection. As I said before, wires break within the insulation.
Wires come loose from the molex connector. Neither is visible.
______________

> I know it can be risky to arbitrarily disconnect a good connection
> and reconnect, haven't done a lot of that, and it can happen that
> the connector/board is ruined.

Where did you get an idea like that? Plugs are unplugged/plugged all
the time - on computers and anything else that runs on electricity.
___________________

> Before I spend a few days to digest all that data, or dig into the
> cables, there is one question that was not answered.
>
> When I apply power, the 3 case lights flash. If the supply is dead,
> no output, so the hard drive light would not light? The 3rd light
> (?) is surely an output light and it would not light? Even the
> power light is probably on the PS output, not across the power
> switch, so it would not light if the PS was dead?

No power no lights. Which doesn't mean that there is intermittently
no power to something because of a bad connection.

Something else that could be loose/bad is RAM. No RAM no boot.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

 

[ms]

"dadiOH" <dadiOH@guesswhere.com> wrote in news:eh0peYFBIHA.464
@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:

> ms wrote:
>
>> This desktop is basic inside, no extras. Each connector is very
>> firmly in place.
>
> Just because it is firmly in place doesn't mean there is a good
> connection. As I said before, wires break within the insulation.
> Wires come loose from the molex connector. Neither is visible.
> ______________
>
>> I know it can be risky to arbitrarily disconnect a good connection
>> and reconnect, haven't done a lot of that, and it can happen that
>> the connector/board is ruined.
>
> Where did you get an idea like that? Plugs are unplugged/plugged all
> the time - on computers and anything else that runs on electricity.

Computer cards and connectors are different, as you know. I have seen by
others, and myself, that disconnecting in an old computer can be
problems.

That's where I got an idea like that.

Thanks for the other help, will look again at connections.

ms

 

[dadiOH]

ms wrote:

>>> I know it can be risky to arbitrarily disconnect a good connection
>>> and reconnect, haven't done a lot of that, and it can happen that
>>> the connector/board is ruined.
>>
>> Where did you get an idea like that? Plugs are unplugged/plugged
>> all the time - on computers and anything else that runs on
>> electricity.
>
> Computer cards and connectors are different, as you know. I have
> seen by others, and myself, that disconnecting in an old computer
> can be problems.

Horse hockey.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

 

[ms]

"dadiOH" <dadiOH@guesswhere.com> wrote in news:u1h$neHBIHA.5196
@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:

> ms wrote:
>
>>>> I know it can be risky to arbitrarily disconnect a good connection
>>>> and reconnect, haven't done a lot of that, and it can happen that
>>>> the connector/board is ruined.
>>>
>>> Where did you get an idea like that? Plugs are unplugged/plugged
>>> all the time - on computers and anything else that runs on
>>> electricity.
>>
>> Computer cards and connectors are different, as you know. I have
>> seen by others, and myself, that disconnecting in an old computer
>> can be problems.
>
> Horse hockey.
>

Dumb answer. It still happens, even if it isn't in your experience.

You enter my threads whenever I post here. Up to now here, you were
helpful. Try to continue in that vein in the future, as I don't need to
post here very often.

ms

 

[w_tom]

On Oct 1, 1:31 pm, ms <m...@invalid.com> wrote:
> I applied power again, also the floppy drive light came on, believe this
> is saying the floppy drive is getting power from the PS. Turned off AC,
> turned it on again seconds later, now no lights show. Repeated test, no
> lights.
>
> Indicates a dead PS?

Also indicates a motherboard problem, a switch problem, a ... No
one provides a definitive answer because numbers are not provided.
Those numbers (without disconnecting anything) can be obtained in but
two minutes. Those numbers means a definitive answer - no
speculation.

Confirm integrity of critical subsystems. First is the power
supply 'system'. Note - it is a 'system'. Power supply is only one
component. Two minute procedure is in "When your computer dies
without warning....." starting 6 Feb 2007 in the newsgroup
alt.windows-xp at:
http://tinyurl.com/yvf9vh

In your case, numbers are taken before and during power up both when
computer does power up AND taken again when computer does not power
up. Your symptoms are typical of a computer whose power supply
'system' has always been defective. Computer with a defective power
supply can still power up most every time. Only way to locate that
defect is with the multimeter.

Post those numbers here. Numbers will contain additional
information. Information that others may use to better suggest a next
action. With those numbers, the power supply 'system' (including
connectors) will be 'definitively good' or 'definitively bad'. No
doubts will remain. No reason to even look bad when we move on to
other suspects. Quite possible that the power supply was always
defective. Others who did not use the meter would have never known of
that defect.

 

[Dan]

I agree fully with w_tom you need to provide us with more information so we
as a group can make a good decision to help you. I will provide suggestions
when you give us data about your computer that was requested nicely by w_tom.

 

[Dan]

If you are going to have an atiitude with dadiOH then you can leave quietly
and quickly. There are many other Microsoft newsgroups that tolerate
people's arguments and this is not one of them and so I ask you can you be
civil to others and not call them dumb or did you just need to leave right
now.