Windows Firewall Dropping Return UDP Packets

W

Will

I have a Windows 2003 Server Domain Controller with Windows Firewall enabled
and set up correctly, and the domain controller works fine. But I
occasionally see dropped packets for protocols in the pfirewall.log file
that are absolutely authorized for travel through the firewall. For
example, we have rules that allow any incoming packets on UDP ports 53, 88,
and 389, yet I still see entries in Windows firewall such as these:

2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
2008-03-05 18:47:01 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3826 53
105 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
2008-03-05 18:47:02 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3830 88
1403 - - - - - - - RECEIVE

192.168.105.13 is the host that is protected by the firewall in this case,
and 192.168.14.121 is a member server communicating to the domain
controller.

I'm well aware of the many special requirements that domain controllers have
when used with firewalls. I don't need to read Knowledgebase 555381 for
example.

My question is under what circumstances does it make sense for the firewall
to be blocking the above UDP packets when the firewall rule explicitly
allows them as exceptions? Maybe someone who understands details about
the Windows Firewall's internals could explain why such packets might be
dropped.

--
Will
 
R

Roger Abell [MVP]

"Will" <westes-usc@noemail.nospam> wrote in message
news:EoudnY9yvvBZNFLanZ2dnUVZ_jCdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>I have a Windows 2003 Server Domain Controller with Windows Firewall
>enabled and set up correctly, and the domain controller works fine. But
>I occasionally see dropped packets for protocols in the pfirewall.log file
>that are absolutely authorized for travel through the firewall. For
>example, we have rules that allow any incoming packets on UDP ports 53, 88,
>and 389, yet I still see entries in Windows firewall such as these:
>
> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
> 2008-03-05 18:47:01 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3826 53
> 105 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
> 2008-03-05 18:47:02 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3830 88
> 1403 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>
> 192.168.105.13 is the host that is protected by the firewall in this case,
> and 192.168.14.121 is a member server communicating to the domain
> controller.
>
> I'm well aware of the many special requirements that domain controllers
> have when used with firewalls. I don't need to read Knowledgebase 555381
> for example.
>
> My question is under what circumstances does it make sense for the
> firewall to be blocking the above UDP packets when the firewall rule
> explicitly allows them as exceptions? Maybe someone who understands
> details about the Windows Firewall's internals could explain why such
> packets might be dropped.
>

Or perhaps not, but I did want to check to make sure you have taken
into account any blocking rule that would name the origin IP of the
member server, directly or by subnet match. A more origin specific
block rule would be the only documented, expected behavior in a
non-misbehaving implementation AFAIK.

Roger

Roger
 
W

Will

"Roger Abell [MVP]" <mvpNoSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
news:OhaxJvZgIHA.2268@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> Or perhaps not, but I did want to check to make sure you have taken
> into account any blocking rule that would name the origin IP of the
> member server, directly or by subnet match. A more origin specific
> block rule would be the only documented, expected behavior in a
> non-misbehaving implementation AFAIK.

Hi Roger. Does Windows Firewall have any kind of blocking rules? I only
see a list of exceptions in Windows 2003 version of Windows Firewall.

The thing is the host that is being blocked is working on those same ports
just fine with the target domain controller. It appears that only some of
the UDP packets get blocked. Since UDP is stateless, I am completely at a
loss as to why the server would reject some but not all similar packets.

--
Will

"Roger Abell [MVP]" <mvpNoSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
news:OhaxJvZgIHA.2268@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> "Will" <westes-usc@noemail.nospam> wrote in message
> news:EoudnY9yvvBZNFLanZ2dnUVZ_jCdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>I have a Windows 2003 Server Domain Controller with Windows Firewall
>>enabled and set up correctly, and the domain controller works fine. But
>>I occasionally see dropped packets for protocols in the pfirewall.log file
>>that are absolutely authorized for travel through the firewall. For
>>example, we have rules that allow any incoming packets on UDP ports 53,
>>88, and 389, yet I still see entries in Windows firewall such as these:
>>
>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>> 2008-03-05 18:47:01 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3826 53
>> 105 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>> 2008-03-05 18:47:02 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3830 88
>> 1403 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>>
>> 192.168.105.13 is the host that is protected by the firewall in this
>> case, and 192.168.14.121 is a member server communicating to the domain
>> controller.
>>
>> I'm well aware of the many special requirements that domain controllers
>> have when used with firewalls. I don't need to read Knowledgebase 555381
>> for example.
>>
>> My question is under what circumstances does it make sense for the
>> firewall to be blocking the above UDP packets when the firewall rule
>> explicitly allows them as exceptions? Maybe someone who understands
>> details about the Windows Firewall's internals could explain why such
>> packets might be dropped.
>>
>
> Or perhaps not, but I did want to check to make sure you have taken
> into account any blocking rule that would name the origin IP of the
> member server, directly or by subnet match. A more origin specific
> block rule would be the only documented, expected behavior in a
> non-misbehaving implementation AFAIK.
>
> Roger
>
> Roger
>
 
R

Roger Abell [MVP]

"Will" <westes-usc@noemail.nospam> wrote in message
news:w5qdnTqblroq9k7anZ2dnUVZ_vGinZ2d@giganews.com...
> "Roger Abell [MVP]" <mvpNoSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
> news:OhaxJvZgIHA.2268@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>> Or perhaps not, but I did want to check to make sure you have taken
>> into account any blocking rule that would name the origin IP of the
>> member server, directly or by subnet match. A more origin specific
>> block rule would be the only documented, expected behavior in a
>> non-misbehaving implementation AFAIK.
>
> Hi Roger. Does Windows Firewall have any kind of blocking rules? I
> only see a list of exceptions in Windows 2003 version of Windows Firewall.
>
> The thing is the host that is being blocked is working on those same ports
> just fine with the target domain controller. It appears that only some
> of the UDP packets get blocked. Since UDP is stateless, I am completely
> at a loss as to why the server would reject some but not all similar
> packets.
>

Doh ! Quite right Will, guess I was thinking IPsec which I do
tend to use instead of Windows Firewall on W2k3 / W2k3 R2,
as I have incountered some strange behaviors from Windows
Firewall on W2k3 (there once was a KB that stated firewall
might only enforce rules for one IP on interface with multiple,
a KB that sat without change, except in review date, for over
a year - but I have seen W2k3 firewall block all traffic to one
nic, irregularly/unpredictably, on a multihomed server even
though nothing said to block the traffic.)
So, you are right, I was not thinking of W2k3 firewall in my
reply, but I was trying to politely indicate that you may be
seeing a firewall quirk, as at W2k3 I would not be surprised.

Roger



> "Roger Abell [MVP]" <mvpNoSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
> news:OhaxJvZgIHA.2268@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>> "Will" <westes-usc@noemail.nospam> wrote in message
>> news:EoudnY9yvvBZNFLanZ2dnUVZ_jCdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>I have a Windows 2003 Server Domain Controller with Windows Firewall
>>>enabled and set up correctly, and the domain controller works fine.
>>>But I occasionally see dropped packets for protocols in the pfirewall.log
>>>file that are absolutely authorized for travel through the firewall.
>>>For example, we have rules that allow any incoming packets on UDP ports
>>>53, 88, and 389, yet I still see entries in Windows firewall such as
>>>these:
>>>
>>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>>> 2008-03-05 18:47:00 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3825 389
>>> 246 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>>> 2008-03-05 18:47:01 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3826 53
>>> 105 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>>> 2008-03-05 18:47:02 DROP UDP 192.168.14.121 192.168.105.13 3830 88
>>> 1403 - - - - - - - RECEIVE
>>>
>>> 192.168.105.13 is the host that is protected by the firewall in this
>>> case, and 192.168.14.121 is a member server communicating to the domain
>>> controller.
>>>
>>> I'm well aware of the many special requirements that domain controllers
>>> have when used with firewalls. I don't need to read Knowledgebase
>>> 555381 for example.
>>>
>>> My question is under what circumstances does it make sense for the
>>> firewall to be blocking the above UDP packets when the firewall rule
>>> explicitly allows them as exceptions? Maybe someone who understands
>>> details about the Windows Firewall's internals could explain why such
>>> packets might be dropped.
>>>
>>
>> Or perhaps not, but I did want to check to make sure you have taken
>> into account any blocking rule that would name the origin IP of the
>> member server, directly or by subnet match. A more origin specific
>> block rule would be the only documented, expected behavior in a
>> non-misbehaving implementation AFAIK.
>>
>> Roger
>>
>> Roger
>>
>
>
 
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