Available memory after start-up

Graham C · Mar 6, 2008

Not really a problem, but an observation.

I run TClock which apart from the date and time in the system tray has
been configured to show 'available RAM'

For a couple of years I've noticed big variations in the amount of
free memory available immediately after boot-up.

Hence I've just disabled every thing except TClock via MSCONFIG

I have 448 Meg of physical RAM. If I clean boot the PC say ten times
in a row, then after start-up, approximately:

On about six occasions I have 304 Meg of free memory available
On about three occasions I have 264 Meg of free memory
On one occasion I have 230 Meg of free memory

This is 'repeatable', but it seems random as to which figure I get on
startup. I may get two 230s in a row, but will then probably get
plenty of 304s before the odd 264 kicks in.

Just curious as to where 40 or 70 Meg can occasionally disappear to ?

With all the usual stuff (virus checker, firewall, USB monitors etc)
loaded, each of these figures drops by some 25 Meg, hence losing 40 or
70 for apparently nothing is peculiar.

Running 98SE with 'all available updates'

I have noticed on past occasions that some legitimate things seem to
get loaded even though there's no call to the EXE anywhere in the
registry.

The wonders of Windoze!

Graham

MEB · Mar 6, 2008

Try a couple tools to see what's actually happening.

memload
http://web.archive.org/web/20010420234407/http://w1.132.telia.com/~u13200034/memload14.exe -
pops up can't find - open first old web page and file downloads ,, weird
FYI: All the "commontology.de/pub/adamant/" are now dead

autoruns
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb963902.aspx

--

MEB
http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com
_________

"Graham C" <grahamcrisp@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:m901t31f6par988n06sqvfeom0hiqdlh91@4ax.com...
|
| Not really a problem, but an observation.
|
| I run TClock which apart from the date and time in the system tray has
| been configured to show 'available RAM'
|
| For a couple of years I've noticed big variations in the amount of
| free memory available immediately after boot-up.
|
| Hence I've just disabled every thing except TClock via MSCONFIG
|
| I have 448 Meg of physical RAM. If I clean boot the PC say ten times
| in a row, then after start-up, approximately:
|
| On about six occasions I have 304 Meg of free memory available
| On about three occasions I have 264 Meg of free memory
| On one occasion I have 230 Meg of free memory
|
| This is 'repeatable', but it seems random as to which figure I get on
| startup. I may get two 230s in a row, but will then probably get
| plenty of 304s before the odd 264 kicks in.
|
| Just curious as to where 40 or 70 Meg can occasionally disappear to ?
|
| With all the usual stuff (virus checker, firewall, USB monitors etc)
| loaded, each of these figures drops by some 25 Meg, hence losing 40 or
| 70 for apparently nothing is peculiar.
|
| Running 98SE with 'all available updates'
|
| I have noticed on past occasions that some legitimate things seem to
| get loaded even though there's no call to the EXE anywhere in the
| registry.
|
| The wonders of Windoze!
|
| Graham

Franc Zabkar · Mar 10, 2008

On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 23:52:02 +0000, Graham C
<grahamcrisp@btopenworld.com> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>I run TClock which apart from the date and time in the system tray has
>been configured to show 'available RAM'
>
>For a couple of years I've noticed big variations in the amount of
>free memory available immediately after boot-up.

Is it possible that your system RAM is not being properly detected
during the POST? Do you always see the full 448MB in the General tab
of Device Manager?

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

Graham C · Mar 10, 2008

On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 22:52:28 -0500, "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> Try a couple tools to see what's actually happening.
>
>autoruns
>http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb963902.aspx

This was good - though the 'Compare' function didn't seem to work.

I booted the machine several times to get the three different start-up
levels

Created log files from each of these, then as the 'Compare' was
defunct, I did a separate binary compare on the three files.

They were identical.

So whatever is grabbing all that memory is no longer running after
start.

Also did a check to ensure all the hard RAM was being detected. It
was.

Hmm

Graham

MEB · Mar 10, 2008

So what was shown as being still in {using} memory by memload?

There was a 1.6 and 2.0 version but I couldn't find a working link for
them.

--

MEB
http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com
_________

"Graham C" <grahamcrisp@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:40hbt359046gg2q40pe55nikbu60beq7ig@4ax.com...
| On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 22:52:28 -0500, "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com>
| wrote:
|
| > Try a couple tools to see what's actually happening.
| >
| >autoruns
| >http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb963902.aspx
|
|
| This was good - though the 'Compare' function didn't seem to work.
|
| I booted the machine several times to get the three different start-up
| levels
|
| Created log files from each of these, then as the 'Compare' was
| defunct, I did a separate binary compare on the three files.
|
| They were identical.
|
| So whatever is grabbing all that memory is no longer running after
| start.
|
| Also did a check to ensure all the hard RAM was being detected. It
| was.
|
| Hmm
|
| Graham

Graham C · Mar 12, 2008

On Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:37:13 -0400, "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> So what was shown as being still in {using} memory by memload?
>
Do you want the list - it came to 3 pages when dropped into Word ?

Mainly MS system DLLs for lots of apps I never use.

Graham

MEB · Mar 12, 2008

What apps?
What DLLS?
Which ones do you think are unimportant?

--

MEB
http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com
_________

"Graham C" <grahamcrisp@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:4gogt3d6o4sga639i13lnphgqmum8eatv4@4ax.com...
| On Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:37:13 -0400, "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com>
| wrote:
|
| > So what was shown as being still in {using} memory by memload?
| >
| Do you want the list - it came to 3 pages when dropped into Word ?
|
| Mainly MS system DLLs for lots of apps I never use.
|
| Graham

Mike Y · Mar 12, 2008

"Graham C" <grahamcrisp@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:m901t31f6par988n06sqvfeom0hiqdlh91@4ax.com...
>
> Not really a problem, but an observation.
>
> I run TClock which apart from the date and time in the system tray has
> been configured to show 'available RAM'
>
> For a couple of years I've noticed big variations in the amount of
> free memory available immediately after boot-up.
>
> Hence I've just disabled every thing except TClock via MSCONFIG
>
> I have 448 Meg of physical RAM. If I clean boot the PC say ten times
> in a row, then after start-up, approximately:
>
> On about six occasions I have 304 Meg of free memory available
> On about three occasions I have 264 Meg of free memory
> On one occasion I have 230 Meg of free memory
>
> This is 'repeatable', but it seems random as to which figure I get on
> startup. I may get two 230s in a row, but will then probably get
> plenty of 304s before the odd 264 kicks in.
>
> Just curious as to where 40 or 70 Meg can occasionally disappear to ?
>
> With all the usual stuff (virus checker, firewall, USB monitors etc)
> loaded, each of these figures drops by some 25 Meg, hence losing 40 or
> 70 for apparently nothing is peculiar.
>
> Running 98SE with 'all available updates'
>
> I have noticed on past occasions that some legitimate things seem to
> get loaded even though there's no call to the EXE anywhere in the
> registry.
>
> The wonders of Windoze!
>
> Graham

I'd verify the integrity of the RAM before I start looking elsewhere. Get
a copy of the MEMTST86 image and run the test from booting the CD.

I'd also see if physical activity changes things. That is, turn the machine
off, unplug it, then try to turn it on (that should drain all the caps).
Then
unplug and replug everything, and see if doing that influences what happens
when you try to boot.

MEB · Mar 12, 2008

"Mike Y" <joe@user.com> wrote in message
news:GQ_Bj.231$E42.54@newsfe02.lga...
|
| "Graham C" <grahamcrisp@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
| news:m901t31f6par988n06sqvfeom0hiqdlh91@4ax.com...
| >
| > Not really a problem, but an observation.
| >
| > I run TClock which apart from the date and time in the system tray has
| > been configured to show 'available RAM'
| >
| > For a couple of years I've noticed big variations in the amount of
| > free memory available immediately after boot-up.
| >
| > Hence I've just disabled every thing except TClock via MSCONFIG
| >
| > I have 448 Meg of physical RAM. If I clean boot the PC say ten times
| > in a row, then after start-up, approximately:
| >
| > On about six occasions I have 304 Meg of free memory available
| > On about three occasions I have 264 Meg of free memory
| > On one occasion I have 230 Meg of free memory
| >
| > This is 'repeatable', but it seems random as to which figure I get on
| > startup. I may get two 230s in a row, but will then probably get
| > plenty of 304s before the odd 264 kicks in.
| >
| > Just curious as to where 40 or 70 Meg can occasionally disappear to ?
| >
| > With all the usual stuff (virus checker, firewall, USB monitors etc)
| > loaded, each of these figures drops by some 25 Meg, hence losing 40 or
| > 70 for apparently nothing is peculiar.
| >
| > Running 98SE with 'all available updates'
| >
| > I have noticed on past occasions that some legitimate things seem to
| > get loaded even though there's no call to the EXE anywhere in the
| > registry.
| >
| > The wonders of Windoze!
| >
| > Graham
|
| I'd verify the integrity of the RAM before I start looking elsewhere. Get
| a copy of the MEMTST86 image and run the test from booting the CD.
|
| I'd also see if physical activity changes things. That is, turn the
machine
| off, unplug it, then try to turn it on (that should drain all the caps).
| Then
| unplug and replug everything, and see if doing that influences what
happens
| when you try to boot.
|

It would appear that the large discrepancy in start memory could be
associated with intermittent ram issues. Might be advisable to find out what
the chip configuration is as well. Strange chip configuration to come up
with 448 megs.
256+128+64 - 128+128+128+64 - 256+64+64+64, any of these would be a bad
combination, and the chips MAY not be fully compatible with each other.
Paging, CAS, you name it, may be {are} different .
448 Meg of physical RAM x 1024 = 458,752
304 Meg -144
264 Meg -184
230 Meg -218

--

MEB
http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com
_________

Graham C · Mar 15, 2008

On Wed, 12 Mar 2008 21:39:31 -0400, "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> What apps?
> What DLLS?
> Which ones do you think are unimportant?

A small selection of the file.
I've abbreviated Windows System (File) to WSF
and Microsoft Corporation to MC

I notice many get loaded several times from LOCAL_MACHINE,
CURRENT_USER etc

+ Web Folders ADVPACK MC c:\w98\system\advpack.dll
+ WS- Color Schemes WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Dial-Up Networking WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Games WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Links Bar c:\w98\command\sulfnbk.exe
+ WS- Messaging WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Netwatch WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Online Services WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Phone Dialer WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Sound Schemes WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- System Information WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- System Information WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- System Meter WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- System Monitor WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Telephony Support WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- The Microsoft Network WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WS- Wordpad WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
+ WinZip e:\98\utils\winzip\wzshlext.dll
+ WinZip e:\98\utils\winzip\wzshlext.dll
+ WinZip e:\98\utils\winzip\wzshlext.dll
+ Microsoft Access Custom Icon Handler MSAPP Export Support for
Microsoft Access MC e:\mso\office\soa800.dll
+ Microsoft Exchange Microsoft Shell Extension Library MC
c:\program files\windows messaging\mlshext.dll
HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Internet Explorer\Toolbar
+ &Radio Windows Media Player 2 ActiveX Control MC
c:\w98\system\msdxm.ocx

Graham

MEB · Mar 15, 2008

"Graham C" <grahamcrisp@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:02ant3ds6fjvo376vhcdf1jbbgff2ann7i@4ax.com...
| On Wed, 12 Mar 2008 21:39:31 -0400, "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com>
| wrote:
|
| > What apps?
| > What DLLS?
| > Which ones do you think are unimportant?
|
| A small selection of the file.
| I've abbreviated Windows System (File) to WSF
| and Microsoft Corporation to MC
|
| I notice many get loaded several times from LOCAL_MACHINE,
| CURRENT_USER etc
|
| + Web Folders ADVPACK MC c:\w98\system\advpack.dll
| + WS- Color Schemes WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Dial-Up Networking WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Games WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Links Bar c:\w98\command\sulfnbk.exe
| + WS- Messaging WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Multimedia WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Netwatch WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Online Services WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Phone Dialer WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Sound Schemes WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- System Information WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- System Information WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- System Meter WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- System Monitor WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Telephony Support WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- The Microsoft Network WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WS- Wordpad WSF MC c:\w98\system\setupx.dll
| + WinZip e:\98\utils\winzip\wzshlext.dll
| + WinZip e:\98\utils\winzip\wzshlext.dll
| + WinZip e:\98\utils\winzip\wzshlext.dll
| + Microsoft Access Custom Icon Handler MSAPP Export Support for
| Microsoft Access MC e:\mso\office\soa800.dll
| + Microsoft Exchange Microsoft Shell Extension Library MC
| c:\program files\windows messaging\mlshext.dll
| HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Internet Explorer\Toolbar
| + &Radio Windows Media Player 2 ActiveX Control MC
| c:\w98\system\msdxm.ocx
|
| Graham

Huh,, are you saying these are still RUNNING and LOADED and shown by
*MEMLOAD*, or did you just find them in the registry... or did you monitor
the startup, which loads a heck of a lot of stuff and uses the same DLLS for
much of the work, but most gets removed...

Or was this from autoruns {looks like it was}:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb963902.aspx - See what's
autoloaded and by what... note, many are *hooks*/stubs, so this ISN'T a good
indication of memory load, but an indication of what you could *possibly*
disable.. and not much or you may kill the system!!.

Or have you actually tested your memory chips yet to see if you might have
failing chips/bad ram? Did you miss that side discussion, your memory
variables seem to indicate the potential?

--

MEB
http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com
_________

Available memory after start-up

Graham C

MEB

Franc Zabkar

Graham C

MEB

Graham C

MEB

Mike Y

MEB

Graham C

MEB

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