Guest Beth Melton Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 Since it's the failure of the Genuine Advantage Test that prevents you from obtaining the downloads I'm fairly certain if you can get the updates downloaded you can install them. And I know most of the security updates don't force the Genuine Advantage Test. (When I said "you can't download anything" -- I meant "download anything that requires the test.) I say, "fairly certain" because I haven't tested this scenario (I'm only 100% on things I've witnessed with my own eyes -)), but I know the rationale behind the Genuine Advantage Test isn't to prevent folks from getting updates installed, it's to provide an advantage, such as download templates from the Template Gallery, ClipArt, etc, to those who have what their test considers "genuine". ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton Microsoft Office MVP https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs Guides for the Office 2007 Interface: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/training/HA102295841033.aspx "...winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote in message news:eGnpVSIBJHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > So the presence of only the 03 Proofing Tools on an XP/Office 2007 system > causes Windows and Office 2007 to fail even if downloading the updates > manually from the Msft Download site even with Office using a separate > Active X GVA add-on. > > Thanks...time to run a test on an XPSp3 system > -- > ...winston > ms-mvp mail > > > "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message > news:uz#plaBBJHA.528@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... >> How about e. Office 2007 and Windows will fail the Genuine Advantage test >> and you're unable to download anything that requires you to pass the >> test. :-) >> >> If the OP wants to keep OE and install the Proofing Tools from Office >> 2003 then they'd need to install more than just the Proofing Tools in >> order to trigger activation.
Guest Beth Melton Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 You know....I passed along what I encountered with the Proofing Tools installation to Microsoft along with a plea for the Genuine Advantage Test to not be so aggressive in its test back when folks were installing the Proofing Tools from a previous version of Office when Office 2007 was released and this issue with the OE proofing tools first cropped up. I asked if they could do something that disregarded components and check only if the version had the actual applications installed but since they were remaining firm on not offering a Microsoft alternative (that was my first mission on this issue) I didn't get my hopes up. <grin> If you were able to pass the Genuine Advantage Test with only the Office 2003 Proofing Tools installed then they may have actually listened! :-) I'll check to confirm and If I can get a definite answer I'll post back. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton Microsoft Office MVP https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs Guides for the Office 2007 Interface: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/training/HA102295841033.aspx "...winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote in message news:e4M3qaaBJHA.3204@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > Sorry, I'm going to have to disagree.. > > a, b, c, d, e, = Nothing failed validation. > > Clean install of XPSp3(slipstreamed cd from Sp2) and Office 2007 > Professional on a spare drive. > Outlook Express has only French spell check as expected > Installed Office 2003 Proofing Tools using Office 2003 Std CD(Custom > install, all deselected except Proofing Tools) > Add-Remove shows 45.8 Mb for Office 2003 > OE now has all available spell checkers(English, English Australian, > Spanish, etc) > > Windows Update(Microsoft Update) loads and validates fine and offers 3 > Office 2003 updates and 14 Office 2007 updates(this was a fresh install > thus it offers Sp3(2003) and Sp1(2007)) > > Checking same on Office Online, passes validation and offers more > 'potential updates' since it also shows those available if Office 2003 Sp3 > and Office 2007 Sp1 were installed. > > All Office 2003 were installed using Windows Update after installing Sp3. > Office 2007 Sp1 installed using MU, which yielded 10 updates post Sp1 > Those 10 update were installed as follows: > 4 of 10 installed via MU > 3 downloaded manually via msft download site and installed offline > 3 installed via Office Online. > > XPSp3 updated via MU - 16 or 17 updates done successfully > The last one of the 17 total...XPSP3 online validation can be tested by > manually accessing this script update which requires validation prior to > download. > http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=951978 > - ie. it attempting to download it manually requires validation and Active > X install, just as WU/MU does. > KB951978 installed fine.
Guest D. Spencer Hines Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 This doesn't seem to make a lot of sense. Isn't the purpose of the GAT to prevent people who have unauthorized copies of Windows or other MS products, pirated copies or trying to use them on more than one machine -- from being able to upgrade those non-kosher copies of MS software?... Which is perfectly reasonable on Microsoft's part. -- DSH Lux et Veritas et Libertas Vires et Honor "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message news:#176rzzBJHA.2292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... [...] > I say, "fairly certain" because I haven't tested this scenario (I'm only > 100% on things I've witnessed with my own eyes -)), but I know the > rationale behind the Genuine Advantage Test isn't to prevent folks from > getting updates installed, it's to provide an advantage, such as download > templates from the Template Gallery, ClipArt, etc, to those who have what > their test considers "genuine". > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Beth Melton > Microsoft Office MVP > https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton > What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs
Guest Earle Horton Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 "remaining firm on not offering a Microsoft alternative", does this mean that Microsoft intentionally left OE and MSN users without a spelling checker, just for some internal political reason? Byzantine. Earle "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message news:eHCLszzBJHA.2292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... > You know....I passed along what I encountered with the Proofing Tools > installation to Microsoft along with a plea for the Genuine Advantage Test > to not be so aggressive in its test back when folks were installing the > Proofing Tools from a previous version of Office when Office 2007 was > released and this issue with the OE proofing tools first cropped up. I > asked if they could do something that disregarded components and check > only if the version had the actual applications installed but since they > were remaining firm on not offering a Microsoft alternative (that was my > first mission on this issue) I didn't get my hopes up. <grin> > > If you were able to pass the Genuine Advantage Test with only the Office > 2003 Proofing Tools installed then they may have actually listened! :-) > I'll check to confirm and If I can get a definite answer I'll post back. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Beth Melton > Microsoft Office MVP > https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton > What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs > > Guides for the Office 2007 Interface: > http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/training/HA102295841033.aspx > > > "...winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:e4M3qaaBJHA.3204@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... >> Sorry, I'm going to have to disagree.. >> >> a, b, c, d, e, = Nothing failed validation. >> >> Clean install of XPSp3(slipstreamed cd from Sp2) and Office 2007 >> Professional on a spare drive. >> Outlook Express has only French spell check as expected >> Installed Office 2003 Proofing Tools using Office 2003 Std CD(Custom >> install, all deselected except Proofing Tools) >> Add-Remove shows 45.8 Mb for Office 2003 >> OE now has all available spell checkers(English, English Australian, >> Spanish, etc) >> >> Windows Update(Microsoft Update) loads and validates fine and offers 3 >> Office 2003 updates and 14 Office 2007 updates(this was a fresh install >> thus it offers Sp3(2003) and Sp1(2007)) >> >> Checking same on Office Online, passes validation and offers more >> 'potential updates' since it also shows those available if Office 2003 >> Sp3 and Office 2007 Sp1 were installed. >> >> All Office 2003 were installed using Windows Update after installing Sp3. >> Office 2007 Sp1 installed using MU, which yielded 10 updates post Sp1 >> Those 10 update were installed as follows: >> 4 of 10 installed via MU >> 3 downloaded manually via msft download site and installed offline >> 3 installed via Office Online. >> >> XPSp3 updated via MU - 16 or 17 updates done successfully >> The last one of the 17 total...XPSP3 online validation can be tested by >> manually accessing this script update which requires validation prior to >> download. >> http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=951978 >> - ie. it attempting to download it manually requires validation and >> Active X install, just as WU/MU does. >> KB951978 installed fine. > >
Guest Kayman Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:24:16 -0600, Earle Horton wrote: > "remaining firm on not offering a Microsoft alternative", does this mean > that Microsoft intentionally left OE and MSN users without a spelling > checker, just for some internal political reason? Byzantine. This wouldn't surprise me at all. It is not unusual that in Multi National Organizations such as MSFT the Section Heads of the Commercial Department and the Program Engineers (Operating Department), are having conflicting opinions as they work for different goals. The Program Engineers are the pragmatic type, they develop things, they *know* things. They have to demonstrate high integrity in order to produce high quality software. The Advertising People know how to sell and push things. They mostly walk on a fine line but cross it frequently for the sake of the $ almighty and in the name of the share holders. The nature of their job prevents them to be moral and ethical. The goals of the Commercial Dept. are not necessarily in the best interest for the end user. Would MSFT recommend the use of registry cleaners if Mark Russinovich and Ed Bott had a say? Would MSFT recommend the use of PFW if Jesper M. Johansson and Steve Riley had a say? Would MSFT have included (lame) additions to their Windows Life OneCare application if their program engineers had a say? HELL NO! The Office 2007 / OE6 spell checker issue is just another example.
Guest Earle Horton Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 Reword Beth's statement to read «The rationale behind the Genuine Advantage Test is to prevent unauthorized folks from getting updates installed, also to provide an advantage, such as download templates from the Template Gallery, ClipArt, etc, to those who have what their test considers "genuine".» Three words make such a big difference. Earle "D. Spencer Hines" <panther@excelsior.com> wrote in message news:uQhZUM0BJHA.2264@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... > This doesn't seem to make a lot of sense. > > Isn't the purpose of the GAT to prevent people who have unauthorized > copies > of Windows or other MS products, pirated copies or trying to use them on > more than one machine -- from being able to upgrade those non-kosher > copies > of MS software?... > > Which is perfectly reasonable on Microsoft's part. > -- > DSH > Lux et Veritas et Libertas > Vires et Honor > > "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message > news:#176rzzBJHA.2292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... > > [...] > >> I say, "fairly certain" because I haven't tested this scenario (I'm only >> 100% on things I've witnessed with my own eyes -)), but I know the >> rationale behind the Genuine Advantage Test isn't to prevent folks from >> getting updates installed, it's to provide an advantage, such as download >> templates from the Template Gallery, ClipArt, etc, to those who have what >> their test considers "genuine". >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> Beth Melton >> Microsoft Office MVP >> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton >> What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs > >
Guest Beth Melton Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 As a follow-up question, Winston did you actually download something that required the Genuine Advantage Test such as the template in this link? http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/templates/TC101927481033.aspx?pid=CT101043261033 If you used Office Online to obtain Office updates then you weren't required to pass Genuine Advantage for Office. Also, KB951978 requires Windows Advantage validation, not Office. I misspoke previously when I included Windows in the failure of the Genuine Advantage test since it uses its own. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton Microsoft Office MVP https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs Guides for the Office 2007 Interface: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/training/HA102295841033.aspx "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message news:eHCLszzBJHA.2292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... > You know....I passed along what I encountered with the Proofing Tools > installation to Microsoft along with a plea for the Genuine Advantage Test > to not be so aggressive in its test back when folks were installing the > Proofing Tools from a previous version of Office when Office 2007 was > released and this issue with the OE proofing tools first cropped up. I > asked if they could do something that disregarded components and check > only if the version had the actual applications installed but since they > were remaining firm on not offering a Microsoft alternative (that was my > first mission on this issue) I didn't get my hopes up. <grin> > > If you were able to pass the Genuine Advantage Test with only the Office > 2003 Proofing Tools installed then they may have actually listened! :-) > I'll check to confirm and If I can get a definite answer I'll post back. > "...winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:e4M3qaaBJHA.3204@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... >> Sorry, I'm going to have to disagree.. >> >> a, b, c, d, e, = Nothing failed validation. >> >> Clean install of XPSp3(slipstreamed cd from Sp2) and Office 2007 >> Professional on a spare drive. >> Outlook Express has only French spell check as expected >> Installed Office 2003 Proofing Tools using Office 2003 Std CD(Custom >> install, all deselected except Proofing Tools) >> Add-Remove shows 45.8 Mb for Office 2003 >> OE now has all available spell checkers(English, English Australian, >> Spanish, etc) >> >> Windows Update(Microsoft Update) loads and validates fine and offers 3 >> Office 2003 updates and 14 Office 2007 updates(this was a fresh install >> thus it offers Sp3(2003) and Sp1(2007)) >> >> Checking same on Office Online, passes validation and offers more >> 'potential updates' since it also shows those available if Office 2003 >> Sp3 and Office 2007 Sp1 were installed. >> >> All Office 2003 were installed using Windows Update after installing Sp3. >> Office 2007 Sp1 installed using MU, which yielded 10 updates post Sp1 >> Those 10 update were installed as follows: >> 4 of 10 installed via MU >> 3 downloaded manually via msft download site and installed offline >> 3 installed via Office Online. >> >> XPSp3 updated via MU - 16 or 17 updates done successfully >> The last one of the 17 total...XPSP3 online validation can be tested by >> manually accessing this script update which requires validation prior to >> download. >> http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=951978 >> - ie. it attempting to download it manually requires validation and >> Active X install, just as WU/MU does. >> KB951978 installed fine.
Guest D. Spencer Hines Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 Bingo!... Although it needs additional wordsmithing and grammatical smoothing. We're not just talking about some templates here. -- DSH Lux et Veritas et Libertas Vires et Honor "Earle Horton" <earleh_nospam_@live.com> wrote in message news:u5Qufw4BJHA.4700@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > Reword Beth's statement to read «The rationale behind the Genuine > Advantage Test is to prevent unauthorized folks from getting updates > installed, also to provide an advantage, such as download[ing] templates > from the Template Gallery, ClipArt, etc, to those who have what their test > considers "genuine".» > > Three words make such a big difference. > > Earle > > "D. Spencer Hines" <panther@excelsior.com> wrote in message > news:uQhZUM0BJHA.2264@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... >> This doesn't seem to make a lot of sense. >> >> Isn't the purpose of the GAT to prevent people who have unauthorized >> copies >> of Windows or other MS products, pirated copies or trying to use them on >> more than one machine -- from being able to upgrade those non-kosher >> copies >> of MS software?... >> >> Which is perfectly reasonable on Microsoft's part. >> -- >> DSH >> Lux et Veritas et Libertas >> Vires et Honor >> >> "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message >> news:#176rzzBJHA.2292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >> >> [...] >> >>> I say, "fairly certain" because I haven't tested this scenario (I'm only >>> 100% on things I've witnessed with my own eyes -)), but I know the >>> rationale behind the Genuine Advantage Test isn't to prevent folks from >>> getting updates installed, it's to provide an advantage, such as >>> download >>> templates from the Template Gallery, ClipArt, etc, to those who have >>> what >>> their test considers "genuine". >>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >>> Beth Melton >>> Microsoft Office MVP >>> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton >>> What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs
Guest Earle Horton Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 You mean "Office", that Office has its own verification? That seems to be the case when one tries to download something from Office Online. Earle "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message news:eT89ux4BJHA.4932@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > As a follow-up question, Winston did you actually download something that > required the Genuine Advantage Test such as the template in this link? > http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/templates/TC101927481033.aspx?pid=CT101043261033 > > If you used Office Online to obtain Office updates then you weren't > required to pass Genuine Advantage for Office. Also, KB951978 requires > Windows Advantage validation, not Office. I misspoke previously when I > included Windows in the failure of the Genuine Advantage test since it > uses its own. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Beth Melton > Microsoft Office MVP > https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton > What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs > > Guides for the Office 2007 Interface: > http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/training/HA102295841033.aspx > > > "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message > news:eHCLszzBJHA.2292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >> You know....I passed along what I encountered with the Proofing Tools >> installation to Microsoft along with a plea for the Genuine Advantage >> Test to not be so aggressive in its test back when folks were installing >> the Proofing Tools from a previous version of Office when Office 2007 was >> released and this issue with the OE proofing tools first cropped up. I >> asked if they could do something that disregarded components and check >> only if the version had the actual applications installed but since they >> were remaining firm on not offering a Microsoft alternative (that was my >> first mission on this issue) I didn't get my hopes up. <grin> >> >> If you were able to pass the Genuine Advantage Test with only the Office >> 2003 Proofing Tools installed then they may have actually listened! :-) >> I'll check to confirm and If I can get a definite answer I'll post back. > >> "...winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote in message >> news:e4M3qaaBJHA.3204@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... >>> Sorry, I'm going to have to disagree.. >>> >>> a, b, c, d, e, = Nothing failed validation. >>> >>> Clean install of XPSp3(slipstreamed cd from Sp2) and Office 2007 >>> Professional on a spare drive. >>> Outlook Express has only French spell check as expected >>> Installed Office 2003 Proofing Tools using Office 2003 Std CD(Custom >>> install, all deselected except Proofing Tools) >>> Add-Remove shows 45.8 Mb for Office 2003 >>> OE now has all available spell checkers(English, English Australian, >>> Spanish, etc) >>> >>> Windows Update(Microsoft Update) loads and validates fine and offers 3 >>> Office 2003 updates and 14 Office 2007 updates(this was a fresh install >>> thus it offers Sp3(2003) and Sp1(2007)) >>> >>> Checking same on Office Online, passes validation and offers more >>> 'potential updates' since it also shows those available if Office 2003 >>> Sp3 and Office 2007 Sp1 were installed. >>> >>> All Office 2003 were installed using Windows Update after installing >>> Sp3. >>> Office 2007 Sp1 installed using MU, which yielded 10 updates post Sp1 >>> Those 10 update were installed as follows: >>> 4 of 10 installed via MU >>> 3 downloaded manually via msft download site and installed offline >>> 3 installed via Office Online. >>> >>> XPSp3 updated via MU - 16 or 17 updates done successfully >>> The last one of the 17 total...XPSP3 online validation can be tested by >>> manually accessing this script update which requires validation prior to >>> download. >>> http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=951978 >>> - ie. it attempting to download it manually requires validation and >>> Active X install, just as WU/MU does. >>> KB951978 installed fine. > >
Guest Beth Melton Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Oh, I suspect it has something to do with their attorneys and lawsuits. -) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton Microsoft Office MVP https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs Guides for the Office 2007 Interface: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/training/HA102295841033.aspx "D. Spencer Hines" <panther@excelsior.com> wrote in message news:uQhZUM0BJHA.2264@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... > This doesn't seem to make a lot of sense. > > Isn't the purpose of the GAT to prevent people who have unauthorized > copies > of Windows or other MS products, pirated copies or trying to use them on > more than one machine -- from being able to upgrade those non-kosher > copies > of MS software?... > > Which is perfectly reasonable on Microsoft's part. > > "Beth Melton" <bmelton@mvps.org> wrote in message > news:#176rzzBJHA.2292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... > > [...] > >> I say, "fairly certain" because I haven't tested this scenario (I'm only >> 100% on things I've witnessed with my own eyes -)), but I know the >> rationale behind the Genuine Advantage Test isn't to prevent folks from >> getting updates installed, it's to provide an advantage, such as download >> templates from the Template Gallery, ClipArt, etc, to those who have what >> their test considers "genuine".
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